Wave Music Home
ReleasesCommunityYour OrderWave Music
ArtistsEventsDJ MixesShop

Wave Music Home


Home
About Us
Labels
Distributed Labels
Links




Search


Adv. Search



Subscribe


Email






Go Back   Wave Music Community Board > Tech Talk for Gearheads

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-07-2008, 08:36 PM
ericjustin ericjustin is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: City Of Champions
Posts: 87
Technics Headhell weight When to use?

I was just wondering when the headshell weight should be used? Does it depend on the cartridge? The main reason I am asking is because I just got a brand new set of replacement stylus for my 680 el's and I don't want to ware them out by putting excess weight on them. I am aware of the right way to set the counter weight and anti skate, but where does the headshell weight come in to the picture.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-07-2008, 09:46 PM
jnkarrik jnkarrik is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Posts: 568
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericjustin
I was just wondering when the headshell weight should be used? Does it depend on the cartridge? The main reason I am asking is because I just got a brand new set of replacement stylus for my 680 el's and I don't want to ware them out by putting excess weight on them. I am aware of the right way to set the counter weight and anti skate, but where does the headshell weight come in to the picture.

If, after you have balanced the tonearm and zeroed the indicator dial, you still cannot dial in the correct weight as called for by the stylus specs, then you need to add the weight and re-zero. This puts the zero point of the adjuster farther back on the tonearm, thus giving you more range to dial in heavier weights.

That said, I do not know of a cartridge where this is required. The only people I have known to use the headshell weights are heavy handed scratch DJ's that needed some help keeping the needle in the groove.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-07-2008, 11:28 PM
Special.K Special.K is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Castlemaine, Victoria, Australia
Posts: 630
are you talking about the weight that sits on top (comes with head shell) or the flat plate that comes with the cartridge. i don't use either but i would like to see what other people do!

kieren.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-07-2008, 11:51 PM
Mr ZDUR Mr ZDUR is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 216
Throw that thing away unless you want to destroy your records.
__________________
www.beatelectric.com
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-07-2008, 11:57 PM
ericjustin ericjustin is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: City Of Champions
Posts: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr ZDUR
Throw that thing away unless you want to destroy your records.
Thats what I always thought but was never too sure.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-09-2008, 11:54 PM
nitred's Avatar
nitred nitred is offline
Samplaholic
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 666
Technics Headhell weight When to use?

NEVER! It turns the stylus into a chisel.

I just needed to get that off my chest.
__________________
-Vintage mixers for sale-
* Talent and Skill not included
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10-10-2008, 01:37 AM
manny manny is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Posts: 376
i agree your right
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-10-2008, 07:12 PM
ericjustin ericjustin is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: City Of Champions
Posts: 87
Thanks again everyone. In the trash they go
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10-11-2008, 07:29 AM
virak virak is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericjustin
I was just wondering when the headshell weight should be used? Does it depend on the cartridge?

It depends on the cartridge. The extra headshell weight is there in case you want to increase the tonearm's effective mass. The Technics tonearm has an effective mass of 12.5gr, and is considered a medium mass arm.

If you use a cartridge with low compliance (stiff cantilever suspension), a tonearm mass higher than the Technics might be desirable (if you use a high compliance cartridge, you'll might need a lighter arm).

E.g. a Denon DL-103 is most happy in arms that have an effective mass of 20gr.+. Put on the extra 4gr. weight, an you have 16.5gr. effective mass, and the Denon tracks and sounds better in the Technics arm than without the extra weight (the tonearm must of course be calibrated the usual way after the weight is added).

That's what that weight is for, not to get excessive tracking force.
__________________
MLRX-BRGN

Last edited by virak : 10-11-2008 at 07:34 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 10-11-2008, 11:53 AM
ericjustin ericjustin is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: City Of Champions
Posts: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by virak
It depends on the cartridge. The extra headshell weight is there in case you want to increase the tonearm's effective mass. The Technics tonearm has an effective mass of 12.5gr, and is considered a medium mass arm.

If you use a cartridge with low compliance (stiff cantilever suspension), a tonearm mass higher than the Technics might be desirable (if you use a high compliance cartridge, you'll might need a lighter arm).

E.g. a Denon DL-103 is most happy in arms that have an effective mass of 20gr.+. Put on the extra 4gr. weight, an you have 16.5gr. effective mass, and the Denon tracks and sounds better in the Technics arm than without the extra weight (the tonearm must of course be calibrated the usual way after the weight is added).

That's what that weight is for, not to get excessive tracking force.

Sounds to me like you wouldn't need the extra weight when using a DJ cartridge as opposed to a Hi Fi cart. Its funny you mention the Denon DL-103. I am looking to buy one of those soon for my Thorens TD-111 / Grado Tonearm combo, but I first have to rewire the tonearm. Sorry, I got a little of topic there
Thanks for the help.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 06-24-2009, 10:13 PM
Reticuli Reticuli is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Dayton, Ohio, USA
Posts: 930
When you have a low compliance cart and need more arm mass. 1200 is a mid-mass arm, though the mk2 was *slightly* lighter than the 3 and 5. The Grados and Ortofons benefit from the headshell weight (and leave the OM weight in obviously on the OM orts) and the extra counterweight that I assume you still have. I'm talking arm swing mass, not downforce. Use a precision scale if necessary. More mass with too low compliance keeps the bass from breaking up or hopping the needle out without requiring extra downforce as a half-measure when the highs are already cleaned up...whew! I like a touch of extra downforce over test-record-clean FIM distortion highs just so minor warps don't change the contact pressure too much out of the "envelope" of low distortion, but beyond that it's probably an arm mass issue if you've got problems with warps or bass. If it's a high compliance tip, there's only so much mass you can remove from an arm. Technics heashells are very light, but I wish the arm itself was a 4 or 5 grams one with screw-on weights to bring it up into different categories.
__________________
Pioneer giveaway...

https://www.bpmsupreme.com/newyearne...?ref=5-mKSlxcx
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 06-24-2009, 10:15 PM
Reticuli Reticuli is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Dayton, Ohio, USA
Posts: 930
Oh, the 680EL series is all mid-compliance, so no need for the extra weights. The only changes over the years have been the cantilever mass, which was awfully high on the original...like the HP. Again, think in terms of mass & inertia, not downforce. Adding mass to the cart end gives you more potential downforce, but you don't need to use it. In the case of the EL's, the compliance is such that a 12ish gram arm has just enough inertia that beats in the audible range don't cause the cart to jump and not so much inertia the cart doesn't move with record deviations properly. It's a happy medium.
__________________
Pioneer giveaway...

https://www.bpmsupreme.com/newyearne...?ref=5-mKSlxcx

Last edited by Reticuli : 06-24-2009 at 10:19 PM.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:53 AM.


Powered by vBulletin Version 3.0.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
2006 Wave Music


© Wave Entertainment Group, Inc.