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  #1  
Old 10-05-2011, 09:49 AM
charles0322 charles0322 is offline
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District 36, NYC

Victor Calderone playing on the Gary Stewart Audio system on 36th street..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHm4r468Tvs






















.
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  #2  
Old 10-05-2011, 10:44 AM
der geile ami der geile ami is offline
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wasnt sure if the lights or the sound system were supposd to be featured in that video.

found this in related videos - <iframe width="640" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/msb2QHZLwCA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe> - cool to see the documentation of a stack getting built. brings back some memories with "other guys"
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  #3  
Old 10-05-2011, 10:55 AM
charles0322 charles0322 is offline
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What I think is cool about the video, is it shows the recorded audio from the night and the clarity of the system..

Quote:
Originally Posted by der geile ami
wasnt sure if the lights or the sound system were supposd to be featured in that video.

found this in related videos - <iframe width="640" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/msb2QHZLwCA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe> - cool to see the documentation of a stack getting built. brings back some memories with "other guys"
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  #4  
Old 10-05-2011, 01:36 PM
der geile ami der geile ami is offline
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From the booth, maybe. Sounded like relatively cheap yet frequency response balanced monitors The shots from the mezzanine had lots of reverb

the video is a good marketing tool, but the audio does not exactly give justice to what i imagine the PA sounds like
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  #5  
Old 10-05-2011, 02:37 PM
charles0322 charles0322 is offline
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Red face

put it this way..

in most videos shot with a camera like this in a club.. almost everything sounds like crap.

In this video, the sound is not distorted.. this is not supposed to be a high fidelity audio recording to go with the video, just a promo to show some of the club and booth gear with a top notch dj at the helm.

Maybe GSA can add another video not during club hours with a proper mic to show more the audio fidelity side of things.. and also discussing the equipment and the reasons for certain choices of gear.

As a club patron at D36 I was more than impressed by the clarity of the system, I never needed my ear protection to cut any harshness or to counter fatigue, it was pure, clean and loud. Digital or not.. this system is one of the best I have heard in a very long while.
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  #6  
Old 10-05-2011, 03:36 PM
atf104 atf104 is offline
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It's a phenomenal system. I'll put it this way, ask any DJ in the city where they want to play and most will say D36.
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  #7  
Old 10-05-2011, 06:59 PM
Fred Bissnette Fred Bissnette is offline
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the more i work in the field of pro audio and large scale pa installation the more im questioning the point of custom speakers so called designed for djs etc. it seems like a lot of work just to market it as a small selling point for a club, i mean im tottally on point with custom 3 way crossovers and boutique eqs and mixers this is what makes the difference in my opinion and they are fun toys to use but it really makes no sense to design speakers for this as any 3 way full range cabinet that is of any quality can be wired to be used with a dj crossover. maybe im opening a whole can of worms here but ive seen some really high quality compact line array systems that sound rich and musical and transparant. any cabinet that is designed for long throw can be processed for nearfield playback. ive heard some of the best club systems in the world and i know what they cost and for the same money you can get some of the highest quality names in pro audio and the result would be a system with more versatile options for artists, im just not sure that most custom systems would be the greatest for live aplications and with the advent of the dj becoming more of a live remix artist i believe the sound needs to step up to higher transient capability and headroom, not volume per se but faster attack on aggressive live applications.


just my 2c
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  #8  
Old 10-05-2011, 07:25 PM
Mistick Krewe Mistick Krewe is offline
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I think that some of the custom shop work can be of a higher quality build (in materials, fit and finish)
than many manufacturers are willing or able to produce to meet their price point targets....

some of the cabinets that are being used in these custom builds are also costly to build,
certainly more time and materials used than when constructing acoustic suspension or ported boxes
from a mass manufacturing POV...

and that's not taking into consideration the transportation and storage of finished goods inventory...
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  #9  
Old 10-05-2011, 08:08 PM
Fred Bissnette Fred Bissnette is offline
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this is true for a good portion of the industry but there are some companies that make some damn fine cabinets that cost a mint and deliver the goods

also there are some companies that go out of their way to provide testing facilities and labs that make what they do work on paper as well as in the field very few custom shops can boast such facilities

again this is just my opinion

i have personally built some great cabinets that are def better built than some of the so called pro pa speakers but when you get into real high end gear its hard to match the quality control they have.

peas
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  #10  
Old 10-06-2011, 05:37 AM
der geile ami der geile ami is offline
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Why custom boxes? Cult. History.

Whats funny is that the concert world had the same history, but the box builders sorta grew up and formed companies. On our side, Richard Long was working with eaw. Who knows how things would have developed if he hadnt gotten sick.

i had the opportunity to tour the BMS HQ when demoing some speakers and got to talk to the boss. He recalled his encounters with gsa, as gsa uses his compression drivers. This was recently after hte zouk install, and hte bms guy had a chance to hear the system. His eyes lit up and he described how it did not sound accurate, but CULT, especially regarding tweeter arrays.

To be quite fair to gsa or sbs, the horns they use are not available from any manufacturer. Dash and George mix up with manufactured gear, but as seen in d36 installation videos, there is often a detail of club installation which is not designed into manufactured gear. Whether from meyer or martin, the boxes have connections outside the box. Kenny Powers routed all cables through teh stack to keep the rear clean and guests from tampering. Only a fool would do that with a meyer box, as it would destroy its value.

I question the design of stacks when flying is possible and this is where manufactured boxes come in handy. However, i find that that most high output manufactured boxes do not scale well to our system needs. The coverage angles are too wide or too narrow, the tops dont play low enough with one or two boxes per corner, etc, etc, etc.

If one is doing mobile events, where the size and configuration and city of the system changes, manufactured is the way to go. If installed, are bands intended to play on it? After a few hundred people in dancefloor capacity, bands have a habit of wanting to stick with something they know, and that means playing on a system which would be potentially available in another city.


I dont know how big the gsa operation is, but i wonder if it not a big leap for them to be a normal manufacturer. There are quite a few small companies in germany manufacturing systems (complete with electronics) for niche markets. Companies like Tannoy or eaw have mix and match system components...
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  #11  
Old 10-06-2011, 08:20 AM
Fred Bissnette Fred Bissnette is offline
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excellent point about the box builders


the concert world has the greatful dead to thank for line arrays being popular lol

dont get me wrong i love big black stacks of horn loaded goodness but its a lot of work for visual impact i mean look at the new mos instal they put extentions on the bins just so they would look the business the bins they use dont really need the ext to sound good.
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  #12  
Old 10-06-2011, 09:47 AM
charles0322 charles0322 is offline
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The choice of speakers, configuration & equipment matches that room very well.. Cult or not, it sounds right, tight and better than almost any club I can remember in my experiences. AND definitely better than any other current big club in NYC or the east coast for that matter.

Maybe that guy from BMS doesnt understand the cult.. most manufacturers dont even come close to understanding dance music systems because they arent DJs playing this type of music.. they want a well rounded system that sounds like it "should"

However, DJ's and dancers understand this system.. that is apparent from the smiling faces on every DJ working the system and the attention the place is getting from the scene.

Maybe a company that does line arrays or conventional stacks could come in and make something that sounds ok for all types of events like rock concerts.. they would probably source something from one of the companies youve mentioned.. and it would most probably sound like every other mediocre club because compromises would be made, and because it would be "good enough"..

As for club systems that are trying to compete for touring DJs attention in the NYC market, with a classic NYC club sound, conventional box or not.. there is no system that sounds like D36. Promoters, Clubbers and DJ,s have all noted the difference, and this is due in large part to the GSA system.
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  #13  
Old 10-06-2011, 09:51 AM
charles0322 charles0322 is offline
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MOS.. Martin spent months designing a custom system for that room, using conventional factory boxes?? I dont hear much buzz about it.. it looks huge and is very loud apparently.. and yes it was a lot about looks with that system..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred Bissnette
excellent point about the box builders


the concert world has the greatful dead to thank for line arrays being popular lol

dont get me wrong i love big black stacks of horn loaded goodness but its a lot of work for visual impact i mean look at the new mos instal they put extentions on the bins just so they would look the business the bins they use dont really need the ext to sound good.
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  #14  
Old 10-06-2011, 10:16 AM
der geile ami der geile ami is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred Bissnette
excellent point about the box builders


the concert world has the greatful dead to thank for line arrays being popular lol

dont get me wrong i love big black stacks of horn loaded goodness but its a lot of work for visual impact i mean look at the new mos instal they put extentions on the bins just so they would look the business the bins they use dont really need the ext to sound good.


Well, the dead were just doing what they could given the technology of the time. All of us have Harry Olson to thank for going through the effort to research the theoretics of acoustics and sound propogation. In the case of the dead, they had big audiences to cover, but there were not exactly monitors in the modern sense at that time, so the wall had to serve dual purposes.

FWIW, they later used Meyer horn loaded designs, including big business looking Glyph speakers. I might be mistaken about whethere they played oin the glyph, but meyer worked with both
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  #15  
Old 10-06-2011, 10:53 AM
der geile ami der geile ami is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charles0322
The choice of speakers, configuration & equipment matches that room very well.. Cult or not, it sounds right, tight and better than almost any club I can remember in my experiences. AND definitely better than any other current big club in NYC or the east coast for that matter.

Maybe that guy from BMS doesnt understand the cult.. most manufacturers dont even come close to understanding dance music systems because they arent DJs playing this type of music.. they want a well rounded system that sounds like it "should"

However, DJ's and dancers understand this system.. that is apparent from the smiling faces on every DJ working the system and the attention the place is getting from the scene.

Maybe a company that does line arrays or conventional stacks could come in and make something that sounds ok for all types of events like rock concerts.. they would probably source something from one of the companies youve mentioned.. and it would most probably sound like every other mediocre club because compromises would be made, and because it would be "good enough"..

As for club systems that are trying to compete for touring DJs attention in the NYC market, with a classic NYC club sound, conventional box or not.. there is no system that sounds like D36. Promoters, Clubbers and DJ,s have all noted the difference, and this is due in large part to the GSA system.


Emotion doesnt always translate so well over hte internet, but let me assure you that the BMS guy fully understood GSA's intentions after he heard the system. BMS makes some of the best drivers on the planet, so I would imagine they understand what music is supposed to sound like.

That said, plenty of companies do both line arrays and conventional point source box designs. They are simply tools. The d36 stacks approach a line source in the low mid -mid section. However, im curious if the mid-high section is angled far down enough. I dont really like giant stacks and would rather fly tops. if you listen to a sound with a wide frequency range, the source does not modulate its position up and down.


Have you experienced a system which covers more than just a few hundred to a couple thousand people? It is easy to dismiss line arrays for not being practical in the medium sized club market, and they are not, because the length of an array to have an advantageous over a point source is longer than necessary and the array elements need space for their coupling and decoupling magic to work. However, when a generous flying height is possible, line arrays can perform very well. The same djs lauding the d36 system all play on line arrays for any of their big summer open air or arena gigs.

If anything, I've found that the club markets work more with a "good enough" approach to sound quality, at least compared to talking head settings where the human voice must cleanly and clearly understood by a wide range of people, whether older and hard of hearing or not speaking the presented language as their mother tongue. How about concerts? Sound might not matter for a punk rock show, but it does for the audiences paying multiple amounts what the entrance to a club costs to hear their favorite band or singer perform. If you think about it, the driver of a club system is usually not within the same listening field as the audience.

Not to knock the club or system, but given the relative lack of club options in nyc, I'd still expect it to get attention if the club and system sucked
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  #16  
Old 10-06-2011, 11:16 AM
charles0322 charles0322 is offline
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You seem to understand a lot about the D36 system.. have you heard it in person? If not, hopefully you can one day. I think you would be surprised at the mid highs as well as bass and how well the system is voiced for electronic music.

Can you share a system in your experience in which you were blown away for this application.. I would love to hear something, anything that you feel is at the top of the game using any company or config. in a club anywhere near this size, whether larger or smaller.

Line arrays in festival atmosphere produce little if anything to write home about as far as sound imo. Im sure that is based on sheer size and other factors.

When you have top resident DJs in other NYC clubs demanding to play on the D36 GSA system it speaks volumes.


Quote:
Originally Posted by der geile ami
Emotion doesnt always translate so well over hte internet, but let me assure you that the BMS guy fully understood GSA's intentions after he heard the system. BMS makes some of the best drivers on the planet, so I would imagine they understand what music is supposed to sound like.

That said, plenty of companies do both line arrays and conventional point source box designs. They are simply tools. The d36 stacks approach a line source in the low mid -mid section. However, im curious if the mid-high section is angled far down enough. I dont really like giant stacks and would rather fly tops. if you listen to a sound with a wide frequency range, the source does not modulate its position up and down.


Have you experienced a system which covers more than just a few hundred to a couple thousand people? It is easy to dismiss line arrays for not being practical in the medium sized club market, and they are not, because the length of an array to have an advantageous over a point source is longer than necessary and the array elements need space for their coupling and decoupling magic to work. However, when a generous flying height is possible, line arrays can perform very well. The same djs lauding the d36 system all play on line arrays for any of their big summer open air or arena gigs.

If anything, I've found that the club markets work more with a "good enough" approach to sound quality, at least compared to talking head settings where the human voice must cleanly and clearly understood by a wide range of people, whether older and hard of hearing or not speaking the presented language as their mother tongue. How about concerts? Sound might not matter for a punk rock show, but it does for the audiences paying multiple amounts what the entrance to a club costs to hear their favorite band or singer perform. If you think about it, the driver of a club system is usually not within the same listening field as the audience.

Not to knock the club or system, but given the relative lack of club options in nyc, I'd still expect it to get attention if the club and system sucked
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  #17  
Old 10-06-2011, 11:50 AM
der geile ami der geile ami is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charles0322
You seem to understand a lot about the D36 system.. have you heard it in person? If not, hopefully you can one day. I think you would be surprised at the mid highs as well as bass and how well the system is voiced for electronic music.

Can you share a system in your experience in which you were blown away for this application.. I would love to hear something, anything that you feel is at the top of the game using any company or config. in a club anywhere near this size, whether larger or smaller.

Line arrays in festival atmosphere produce little if anything to write home about as far as sound imo. Im sure that is based on sheer size and other factors.

When you have top resident DJs in other NYC clubs demanding to play on the D36 GSA system it speaks volumes.

Chances are quite slim that I will ever be able to hear the d36 system, but i have built a few stacks on my own. I moved away from ny in 03, and really consider any of my memories to be more emotional from that time.

However, berlin's berghain has big old funktion one dancestacks, and even given the downward angle of the high section, it isnt until I've moved away towards the middle of the dancefloor that I can hear them, and I'm over 6 feet tall.

I've also designed a few stacks and flown rigs for clubs. None have had comparable budgets, but the physics are the same. Stacking everything up and angling down the high section never sounded as good as flying the speakers and angling them down. It wasnt an issue of voicing. I could play with the eq until my hands got tired. Flying the speakers, however, got me where I wanted to be with less adjustment of the eq.


Where has sound really impressed me in recent years? Melt festival a few years ago with a big outdoor vertec line array system with about 8k other people around, Massive attack playing indoors to about 4.5k over an lacoustics system line array, and the arena club (150 -200) person dancefloor) system when i had full control over it and the room acoustics. That I built the arena club system, I am probably biased. The market I am in is not really known for its sound quality, but for the craziness of its parties. Most places do not have the budget or im simply at the wrong gig.

As for resident djs, lets be realistic. DJs always like on big systems, and there are only like 5 possibilities for them in nyc, no?
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  #18  
Old 10-06-2011, 12:08 PM
jnkarrik jnkarrik is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atf104
It's a phenomenal system. I'll put it this way, ask any DJ in the city where they want to play and most will say D36.

I would have to agree - it is absolutely phenomenal. I went on opening night,and it sounded good then - I can only imaine that it has been tweaked and tuned even further in the past 10 months.

IMHO, D36 crushes Twilo, Eleven, and many other systems that had always been my reference for good sound.

My wife is in Singapore this week on business, and I have been trying to convince her to check out Zouk so she can compare the two GSA systems. She went to Womb a few months ago while in Tokyo, and said it was no where close to D36. Loud, but not as clean.
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  #19  
Old 10-06-2011, 04:31 PM
Elliot Thompson Elliot Thompson is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by der geile ami

Not to knock the club or system, but given the relative lack of club options in nyc, I'd still expect it to get attention if the club and system sucked


GSA falls in the same category as those who play Roots/Dub music in the UK.
They focus on one style of music and do their best to create a sound system that enhances the quality of the style of music in question.

Choosing such a route generally leaves you as small company for the most dominate music within your region is not the motive of the sound system design.

In the States, the most dominant music is a toss up between Hip Hop & Rock. Companies such a JBL & EAW design all purpose loudspeakers so they can be used in every market.

Dance music has taken a heavy decline in NYC since 2000. Even the who’s who clubs that offer dance music focus more on a style that falls within the European Industrial House/Trance realm. The closest dance music played in these clubs that follows an American Deep/Funky House style falls within the Ibiza type of category.

So the reality is, companies like GSM will never be as big as likes of JBL or EAW for their market (Funky/Deep House) in the United States is miniscule compared where Funktion-One (Electronic Dance Music sound system design) can flourish due to the popularity of Dance Music in Europe.

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Last edited by Elliot Thompson : 10-06-2011 at 04:33 PM.
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  #20  
Old 10-06-2011, 05:21 PM
charles0322 charles0322 is offline
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funky deep house, lol.. yeah..

today it's Techno. believe it or not it's actually gotten quite big. It may be another genre tag (whatever the kids say these days)

Big room techno, tech-house, dub step.. the actual market for dance music is growing. Hence the success of many dance music related festivals in the New York area, and especially here in Montreal..

Sure it's a niche market for a traditional NYC system that can thump this clear and loud.. we can both agree that GSA is no Harmon mega company..

My best friend is a Harmon employee and he has told me horror stories about service issues, lead times, due in large part to their size as a company..

Gary offers systems in the traditional mindset for a NYC club, but this style works very well with today`s music and technology, and especially for a club like this..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliot Thompson
GSA falls in the same category as those who play Roots/Dub music in the UK.
They focus on one style of music and do their best to create a sound system that enhances the quality of the style of music in question.

Choosing such a route generally leaves you as small company for the most dominate music within your region is not the motive of the sound system design.

In the States, the most dominant music is a toss up between Hip Hop & Rock. Companies such a JBL & EAW design all purpose loudspeakers so they can be used in every market.

Dance music has taken a heavy decline in NYC since 2000. Even the who’s who clubs that offer dance music focus more on a style that falls within the European Industrial House/Trance realm. The closest dance music played in these clubs that follows an American Deep/Funky House style falls within the Ibiza type of category.

So the reality is, companies like GSM will never be as big as likes of JBL or EAW for their market (Funky/Deep House) in the United States is miniscule compared where Funktion-One (Electronic Dance Music sound system design) can flourish due to the popularity of Dance Music in Europe.

Best Regards,
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  #21  
Old 10-06-2011, 11:39 PM
Elliot Thompson Elliot Thompson is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charles0322
funky deep house, lol.. yeah..

today it's Techno. believe it or not it's actually gotten quite big. It may be another genre tag (whatever the kids say these days)

Big room techno, tech-house, dub step.. the actual market for dance music is growing. Hence the success of many dance music related festivals in the New York area, and especially here in Montreal..


That may be true in Canada but not NYC. I don't see why you are trying say otherwise....

The amount of NYC Clubs that shutdown which focused solely on Dance music in the past 20 years is staggering. There are many clubs that closed their doors for good that no new club today can be looked upon as their replacement.


Quote:
Sure it's a niche market for a traditional NYC system that can thump this clear and loud.. we can both agree that GSA is no Harmon mega company..

My best friend is a Harmon employee and he has told me horror stories about service issues, lead times, due in large part to their size as a company..

Please stop trying to downplay Harmon for it looks like you have a hidden agenda especially, when Harmon did not state anything negative to wards GSA.

Quote:
Gary offers systems in the traditional mindset for a NYC club, but this style works very well with today`s music and technology, and especially for a club like this..

But, the system is designed to sound best on deep/funky house music since the design topology hasn't changed in past 35+ years. This is why the concept is just like those in the UK who solely play Dub/Roots music. They follow the same topology as their forefathers for the end result is the best for that style of music.

Surely, if that were not true GSA would have commissioned a job at the biggest legal rave event held in the United States... Ultrafest.



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  #22  
Old 10-07-2011, 12:41 AM
atf104 atf104 is offline
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I've never heard Zouk but played at Womb. Womb's a completely different animal as its really a 10 year old system (indentical system to the original NY Twilo). It's a great system but doesn't quite thump like the original Twilo system. D36 is just loud, much louder.

Randy, I'd have to respectfully disagree on the stack vs flying statement. The best, most coherent, clean and highest fidelity club systems I've ever heard have always been of the stack nature. It goes back to the point-source theory of sound. No matter what you do, its more natural for your ear to hear all frequencies from as close to a point source as possible, including the sub-bass.

Re: the D36 systems design intent being soulful house? Umm, I don't even think they've had a single night of that played there. Their bookings are almost all techno, house and the NYC usuals, JP, Victor, DT coming up, Junior, etc..

The booth is designed with a classic house DJ in mind as the Urei is central to the layout which can be taken as a negative if you're looking to use a Pioneer or A&H tabletop mixer (which sits above where the turntables are). However, that's obviously what the club wanted. I'll say I've heard Victor play there on the Urei with Traktor and it sounded phenomenal on the floor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jnkarrik
I would have to agree - it is absolutely phenomenal. I went on opening night,and it sounded good then - I can only imaine that it has been tweaked and tuned even further in the past 10 months.

IMHO, D36 crushes Twilo, Eleven, and many other systems that had always been my reference for good sound.

My wife is in Singapore this week on business, and I have been trying to convince her to check out Zouk so she can compare the two GSA systems. She went to Womb a few months ago while in Tokyo, and said it was no where close to D36. Loud, but not as clean.
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  #23  
Old 10-07-2011, 04:26 AM
der geile ami der geile ami is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atf104
I've never heard Zouk but played at Womb. Womb's a completely different animal as its really a 10 year old system (indentical system to the original NY Twilo). It's a great system but doesn't quite thump like the original Twilo system. D36 is just loud, much louder.

Randy, I'd have to respectfully disagree on the stack vs flying statement. The best, most coherent, clean and highest fidelity club systems I've ever heard have always been of the stack nature. It goes back to the point-source theory of sound. No matter what you do, its more natural for your ear to hear all frequencies from as close to a point source as possible, including the sub-bass.

But a stack is simply not a point. There is quite a bit of distance between the lower bass woofers and the compression drivers. Run a sweep and the location where the sound emanates changes. This does not happen as much a coaxial design or any other where the different drivers are grouped closer. Throw sucker in the air, and the inverse square law evens out the differences to the listener a bit more. if you look at concert systems, plenty of them also have subs flown, but i concede that a realistic compromise I would make is to keep the subs on the ground.

Take a simple 2-way box with a woofer and a horn. By hanging it about 3m/10ft off the floor and pitching the angle appropriately, the volume loss due to difference is also more equal across the listening area. Higher would be even smoother, but at some point the box is sitting in the reverberant field.

Next time you have a chance, turn on just one stack and listen as you walk away from and towards it. If that sound can be made more consistent as you walk, it should also make the experience more consistent with all sources on.

If womb was a copy of twilo, then the design is even older than 10 years, bar any electronics changes. I met someone who lived in tokyo for a while and also did not like womb, but she did like the mobile womb system. There was another club she mentioned which she liked better, but it closed or something, and nothing was better for her than hte labyrinth funktion one rig.

what we dont know is how the womb system has been maintained, considering the original work was commissioned by a company which no longer exists, or whether local political and legal issues (noise police) prohibit using hte system to its potential.
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  #24  
Old 10-07-2011, 04:48 AM
der geile ami der geile ami is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliot Thompson
GSA falls in the same category as those who play Roots/Dub music in the UK.
They focus on one style of music and do their best to create a sound system that enhances the quality of the style of music in question.

Choosing such a route generally leaves you as small company for the most dominate music within your region is not the motive of the sound system design.

In the States, the most dominant music is a toss up between Hip Hop & Rock. Companies such a JBL & EAW design all purpose loudspeakers so they can be used in every market.

Dance music has taken a heavy decline in NYC since 2000. Even the who’s who clubs that offer dance music focus more on a style that falls within the European Industrial House/Trance realm. The closest dance music played in these clubs that follows an American Deep/Funky House style falls within the Ibiza type of category.

So the reality is, companies like GSM will never be as big as likes of JBL or EAW for their market (Funky/Deep House) in the United States is miniscule compared where Funktion-One (Electronic Dance Music sound system design) can flourish due to the popularity of Dance Music in Europe.

Best Regards,

Iknow what you mean by these dub sound systems. The hardwax record store guys own one and bring it out for their monthly parties. It is a 3m x 6m wall and one can expect to hear some basic channel pumped out of it. It is very smooth, but a completely different listening experience anywhere on the floor due to where the hf horns reach the ears and that their output patterns overlap. It is also a "cult" sound.

However, i disagree that there really needs to be a specific kind of system to do a specific kind of music. Meyer is used for jazz, classical, metallica, and even techno. Vdosc has been successfully used for everything. When the vertec stuff went into the roxy, the first thing the owner played was pink floyd. The only differences dance music has with anything else are lower dynamic range, more bass, and more highs. Lower dynamic range is solved by using a louder system which can handle the required average volume levels, more bass is solved by adding more woofers, or at least having the capacity to push them more, and since there are no acoustic cymbals and such, vhf devices solve that. It might have been true that compression drivers needed tweeter help 20 years ago, but modern compression drivers can provide the desired sizzle.

I know all about dance music's decline in ny. I worked at twilo, shelter, vinyl, arc, and the roxy. However, there are probably more funktion one boxes in the US than GSA. Why is that?

Funktion One was created by the same people that started turbosound, and turbosound has been associated with basically any kind of music in europe. The same boxes which went into 90s berlin Techno clubs were used to mix bands in the 80s.
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  #25  
Old 10-07-2011, 08:22 AM
Fred Bissnette Fred Bissnette is offline
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Vdosc are incredible boxes and are capable of any transients you can throw at them but hella expensive.

we used to rent eaw 850 systems for big partys in the 90s and i was never unimpressed with the spectrum of sound they could push, bass was tight as hell too
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